whipple 4.0

[B.M.F.]

Slipping belt in your case maybe?

 

[Whipple Charged]

I suspect they are waiting until they can confirm a cause and solution. It would only add to the frustration it they handed out "possible" solutions. As I understand it, they are looking at the intake plenum and the bypass actuator.

I believe, I fix my problem by manipulating the bypass actuator but I need more road/track time before I would feel comfortable saying that the problem is solved for sure.

If you do not like the BAP solution, you may want to look at a third fuel pump outside of the tank.

Sorry guys, I'm not on here every day so can't answer all the questions.

Fact is this, the factory tube collapses with smaller pulleys in stock form. The Accufab unit helps both smaller pulleys and the 3.4L up to 19psi. After this, the tube still tries to collapse. The 4.0L has more suction, as it's a larger compressor and has bigger rotor lobes to fill. It sucks the stock and Accufab inlet tube shut at 19+psi. I can't tell you that it will do this cold, but at full temp, it will certainly do it. Filter flow also greatly effects this by increasing vacuum. If your filters are dirty, you'll get increased vacuum which will suck tube shut. The current fix for this is to install the factory support, then the Accufab support. This helps although the tube still bends in some.

The factory airbox is the problem, not the TB. A larger TB will improve performance a little bit, but there is no question the box is the issue. It's the 180deg bend the air has to make and through 2 small flat filters, then a 90 and another 90 bend just to get to the MAF. Every bend causes an inlet pressure drop.

Were working on a new filter/MAF option, but its sometime away with our current projecdt work load. In the meantime, using both supports works fine and gives plenty of air capacity. The TB will also be addressed soon.

As of dropping 8-10psi of boost, you only have a few things it can be, since the SC is mechanical, it either works or doesn't, so it can be:

1. Bypass actuator or bypass blade is stuck in the "open" position. This is very easy to view either while driving (through the window) or while sitting there idiling. You can move actuator arm by hand to see if it's moving correctly. When arm is "up" or inside the actuator, that is open, which is during vacuum operation. It should go "down" when in boost. Very simple to look back and see it moving.

2. Belt slipping. If idler was not adjusted properly, and tensioner is at it's stop, belt will just slip under boost. The newer belts make zero noise during slipping so you wouldn't know, although there should be some extra belt residue by blower pulley. This is easy to fill the belt, if you can move belt around quite a bit when pushing, it's too loose.

3. Air leak. Could have an air leak between SC and manifold, although I've never had this on a GT, its still possible. Thats a lot of boost so this is unlikely.

4. Massive air restriction. This can only be if the TB was going WOT, blade wasn't opening, something clogging air filter, etc. Also very unlikely.

So between this, my bet would be the bypass sticking open and might currently be stuck. Start car, give the throttle a quick rap and you should see it moving back and forth.

Hope this helps.

Dustin

 

[Shadowman]

Sorry guys, I'm not on here every day so can't answer all the questions.

Fact is this, the factory tube collapses with smaller pulleys in stock form. The Accufab unit helps both smaller pulleys and the 3.4L up to 19psi. After this, the tube still tries to collapse. The 4.0L has more suction, as it's a larger compressor and has bigger rotor lobes to fill. It sucks the stock and Accufab inlet tube shut at 19+psi. I can't tell you that it will do this cold, but at full temp, it will certainly do it. Filter flow also greatly effects this by increasing vacuum. If your filters are dirty, you'll get increased vacuum which will suck tube shut. The current fix for this is to install the factory support, then the Accufab support. This helps although the tube still bends in some.

The factory airbox is the problem, not the TB. A larger TB will improve performance a little bit, but there is no question the box is the issue. It's the 180deg bend the air has to make and through 2 small flat filters, then a 90 and another 90 bend just to get to the MAF. Every bend causes an inlet pressure drop.

Were working on a new filter/MAF option, but its sometime away with our current projecdt work load. In the meantime, using both supports works fine and gives plenty of air capacity. The TB will also be addressed soon.

As of dropping 8-10psi of boost, you only have a few things it can be, since the SC is mechanical, it either works or doesn't, so it can be:

1. Bypass actuator or bypass blade is stuck in the "open" position. This is very easy to view either while driving (through the window) or while sitting there idiling. You can move actuator arm by hand to see if it's moving correctly. When arm is "up" or inside the actuator, that is open, which is during vacuum operation. It should go "down" when in boost. Very simple to look back and see it moving.

2. Belt slipping. If idler was not adjusted properly, and tensioner is at it's stop, belt will just slip under boost. The newer belts make zero noise during slipping so you wouldn't know, although there should be some extra belt residue by blower pulley. This is easy to fill the belt, if you can move belt around quite a bit when pushing, it's too loose.

3. Air leak. Could have an air leak between SC and manifold, although I've never had this on a GT, its still possible. Thats a lot of boost so this is unlikely.

4. Massive air restriction. This can only be if the TB was going WOT, blade wasn't opening, something clogging air filter, etc. Also very unlikely.

So between this, my bet would be the bypass sticking open and might currently be stuck. Start car, give the throttle a quick rap and you should see it moving back and forth.

Hope this helps.

Dustin

Dustin; thank you for taking time to share your thoughts and suggestions.

The fact that as a team you were willing to take the supercharger to a new level is appreciated while at the same time it is also very understandable that real time aka field feedback is needed hence the development continues.

Takes care

Shadowman

 

[dealmaker]

Dustin - thanks for the contribution - it's very reassuring to hear you guys are looking at these problems!

I spoke to the my tech today.

He came up with a couple of great ideas - "why don't we either fabricate a replacement Alumnium tube....or simply fabricate a really stiff Alloy support instead of the accufab?"...hopefully either of these will stop the collapse?

His view on the by-pass valev/diapraghm is that with the 4.0Litre, it's seeing so much air and boost on one side that its sticking shut - and theres simply not enough vacuum on the other side to re-open it? Makes sense??

 

[Whipple Charged]

Dustin - thanks for the contribution - it's very reassuring to hear you guys are looking at these problems!

I spoke to the my tech today.

He came up with a couple of great ideas - "why don't we either fabricate a replacement Alumnium tube....or simply fabricate a really stiff Alloy support instead of the accufab?"...hopefully either of these will stop the collapse?

His view on the by-pass valev/diapraghm is that with the 4.0Litre, it's seeing so much air and boost on one side that its sticking shut - and theres simply not enough vacuum on the other side to re-open it? Makes sense??

Yes, someone can make a aluminum support, but this is quite a bit of work because it will have to be made by hand each time. 1's fine, but production is another topic and I can't handle that here. A carbon insert would also help, but I got some better idea's

As for the bypass, highly unlikely. If its going to stick, its normally closed because the bypass throttle blade in the bypass throttle blade bore can stick if it gets to close to center (blade is bigger than bore). This of course gives you full boost though, but hot operation during vacuum operation. To stick in vacuum, it would be typically unrelated to SC size, restrictions, etc., it's typically mechinally stuck. Heim rod touching, bypass butterfly shaft jammed, bypass linkage hung up, etc. And if it's stuck open, it's highly visable, so I encourage everyone to just look at them. You can see what it's doing from inside the car, pretty unique but extremely functional.

Thanks,
Dustin

 

[dealmaker]

Well the Ford Racing Headers, are on - the CAT's removed, the Heffner "bumper delete" exhaust is on - and most importantly the 4.0Litre Whipple is fitted! :banana

The Dyno is booked for early next week so lets see how it does! Fingers crossed!! :thumbsup

 

[Whipple Charged]

Well the Ford Racing Headers, are on - the CAT's removed, the Heffner "bumper delete" exhaust is on - and most importantly the 4.0Litre Whipple is fitted! :banana

The Dyno is booked for early next week so lets see how it does! Fingers crossed!! :thumbsup

Well this should be interesting! Keep us up to date, and please keep the stock air support in there before the Accufab support.

Thanks,
Dustin

 

[Namor]

Dealmaker, I'm counting on you! I will be fascinated to see how your dyno runs go, as i've held off getting the 4.0ltr ordered and installed by Dave Jones until you confirm it works properly.

You really running Ford headers on the road? Dave discouraged me last time we spoke. Very impressed if so.

 

[dealmaker]

Dealmaker, I'm counting on you! I will be fascinated to see how your dyno runs go, as i've held off getting the 4.0ltr ordered and installed by Dave Jones until you confirm it works properly.

You really running Ford headers on the road? Dave discouraged me last time we spoke. Very impressed if so.

Namor,

We should know by Wednesday! Hopefully I won't experience some of the maladies afflicting other users? I do think that the first 3-6 moths will be some trial and error as certain components are identified as the weak link in the chain (eg Throttle body, airbox) - but no doubt once better components are identified/developed to address these issues we will end up with the ulitmate Supercharged application! (I don't like Turbo's - OK for this straight line stuff - not so hot for the sort of twisty "B" roads I drive on)

Dave E is doing the install - the guy really knows his stuff!

Yes I am running the racing headers on the road! As our American biker cousins say "Noisy Pipes -Save Lives" !!

I like to hear whats going on....plus flames are always a good thing!

 

[RALPHIE]

You really running Ford headers on the road? Dave discouraged me last time we spoke. Very impressed if so.

As one of the 1st with them - I love them. To quote others who have heard them (including Borla field personnel) - "It now has the Authority to go with its looks."

 

[Gulf GT]

As one of the 1st with them - I love them. To quote others who have heard them (including Borla field personnel) - "It now has the Authority to go with its looks."

It can be quiet if you drive it, and loud if want it as well. It's a great system, and it's the ultimate for the Ford GT.

 

[Namor]

Alright alright. I'll get the Ford headers. As you say, Safety comes first! I'm definitely looking for flames and haven't seen any out of the Accufab X-pipe I'm on just now.

Dealmaker, if you have to get any parts (eg intake hoses) fabricated for you 4.0ltr installation let me know and we can split the costs for a couple of units.

Bring on Wednesday.

 

[Fubar]

I would also look at Shadowman's exhaust system simply because you can add the cats and/or a muffler as you see fit. The upside of both the Ford Racing headers and Shadowman's exhaust system is there is plenty of room for airbox expansion.

 

[Lorenzo]

I would also look at Shadowman's exhaust system simply because you can add the cats and/or a muffler as you see fit. The upside of both the Ford Racing headers and Shadowman's exhaust system is there is plenty of room for airbox expansion.

:agree: Love mine!!!

 

[paul b]

Sorry guys, I'm not on here every day so can't answer all the questions.

Fact is this, the factory tube collapses with smaller pulleys in stock form. The Accufab unit helps both smaller pulleys and the 3.4L up to 19psi. After this, the tube still tries to collapse. The 4.0L has more suction, as it's a larger compressor and has bigger rotor lobes to fill. It sucks the stock and Accufab inlet tube shut at 19+psi. I can't tell you that it will do this cold, but at full temp, it will certainly do it. Filter flow also greatly effects this by increasing vacuum. If your filters are dirty, you'll get increased vacuum which will suck tube shut. The current fix for this is to install the factory support, then the Accufab support. This helps although the tube still bends in some.

The factory airbox is the problem, not the TB. A larger TB will improve performance a little bit, but there is no question the box is the issue. It's the 180deg bend the air has to make and through 2 small flat filters, then a 90 and another 90 bend just to get to the MAF. Every bend causes an inlet pressure drop.

Were working on a new filter/MAF option, but its sometime away with our current projecdt work load. In the meantime, using both supports works fine and gives plenty of air capacity. The TB will also be addressed soon.

As of dropping 8-10psi of boost, you only have a few things it can be, since the SC is mechanical, it either works or doesn't, so it can be:

1. Bypass actuator or bypass blade is stuck in the "open" position. This is very easy to view either while driving (through the window) or while sitting there idiling. You can move actuator arm by hand to see if it's moving correctly. When arm is "up" or inside the actuator, that is open, which is during vacuum operation. It should go "down" when in boost. Very simple to look back and see it moving.

2. Belt slipping. If idler was not adjusted properly, and tensioner is at it's stop, belt will just slip under boost. The newer belts make zero noise during slipping so you wouldn't know, although there should be some extra belt residue by blower pulley. This is easy to fill the belt, if you can move belt around quite a bit when pushing, it's too loose.

3. Air leak. Could have an air leak between SC and manifold, although I've never had this on a GT, its still possible. Thats a lot of boost so this is unlikely.

4. Massive air restriction. This can only be if the TB was going WOT, blade wasn't opening, something clogging air filter, etc. Also very unlikely.

So between this, my bet would be the bypass sticking open and might currently be stuck. Start car, give the throttle a quick rap and you should see it moving back and forth.

Hope this helps.

Dustin

How about drilling a few holes in the bottom of the air box to flow a little more air? The new air should go thru the filters and relieve some of the intake starvation.

 

[Fubar]

How about drilling a few holes in the bottom of the air box to flow a little more air? The new air should go thru the filters and relieve some of the intake starvation.

Somebody really needs to do a vacuum test before and after the filters to see if the filters are starved for air. I suspect the filter's flow rate is the problem for modified cars.

 

[ChipBeck]

Chip's next gripe = Kip's solution.

Gentlemen,

The Ford GT airbox is something I am quite surprised has not been addressed by our community up to this point. I am also quite active in the Shelby GT500 and Shelby GT communities. With engines quite similar to our own in the GT500, it is well-known that any decrease in inlet restriction on those supercharged cars will lead to a noticeable increase in horsepower. There is more than enough expertise among Forum members to address this shortcoming on our cars and once a proper ultra low restriction air box is designed I intended to badger our carbon fiber High Dalai Lama, Kip Ewing (Ewing, Inc.), to build it! Add to this the new carbon fiber air intake tube that Kip is going to build for us that will replace the stock rubber unit with Accufab support and I can see a minimum 50 hp increase in our automobiles in addition to the cool carbon fiber visuals these items will provide our engine compartments. Here we go. :cheers :banana

Chip

 

[Gulf GT]

Gentlemen,

The Ford GT airbox is something I am quite surprised has not been addressed by our community up to this point. I am also quite active in the Shelby GT500 and Shelby GT communities. With engines quite similar to our own in the GT500, it is well-known that any decrease in inlet restriction on those supercharged cars will lead to a noticeable increase in horsepower. There is more than enough expertise among Forum members to address this shortcoming on our cars and once a proper ultra low restriction air box is designed I intended to badger our carbon fiber High Dalai Lama, Kip Ewing (Ewing, Inc.), to build it! Add to this the new carbon fiber air intake tube that Kip is going to build for us that will replace the stock rubber unit with Accufab support and I can see a minimum 50 hp increase in our automobiles in addition to the cool carbon fiber visuals these items will provide our engine compartments. Here we go. :cheers :banana

Chip

Here Here...Well said.

 

[HeritageBruce]

Gentlemen,

The Ford GT airbox is something I am quite surprised has not been addressed by our community up to this point. I am also quite active in the Shelby GT500 and Shelby GT communities. With engines quite similar to our own in the GT500, it is well-known that any decrease in inlet restriction on those supercharged cars will lead to a noticeable increase in horsepower. There is more than enough expertise among Forum members to address this shortcoming on our cars and once a proper ultra low restriction air box is designed I intended to badger our carbon fiber High Dalai Lama, Kip Ewing (Ewing, Inc.), to build it! Add to this the new carbon fiber air intake tube that Kip is going to build for us that will replace the stock rubber unit with Accufab support and I can see a minimum 50 hp increase in our automobiles in addition to the cool carbon fiber visuals these items will provide our engine compartments. Here we go. :cheers :banana

Chip

That air box/stiffener would be a must have accessory. Where do I get in line to have one?

 

[dealmaker]

That air box/stiffener would be a must have accessory. Where do I get in line to have one?

Looks like there is a big line forming! Kip better drop that GTX roof and get onto this!!