5.8 Liter 2013 Shelby GT-500 Confirmed

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Wow. The ZL1 pity party on the Camaro 5 forum has generated 565 posts in one day. As my late father was fond of saying, this is what happens when your ice cream turns to sh*t.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182436
 
Wow I think the Chevy folks are talking about it way more than we are. The posts are in the 630s. It's like when we were kids talking about the boogieman.

Remember the 80s. They would beat our 5.0s with their 5.7s. Now we bring displacement and technology to the game they are butt hurt.
 
That's why I said I thought it was dumb they were so gung ho on talking ZL1 up as the best thing since sliced bread, specifically related to their competitors. The threads on the Mustang websites aren't nearly as long as the thread on the Camaro site filled with guys explaining how they can upgrade power, next year Chevy will make it faster, is anyone canceling their order, cars are too fast anyways, etc. All before the car ever came out.

Chevy tends to give a pretty good estimate of what their cars will do on a drag strip, and if the 6-speed version using launch control including roll-out will do 12.1@119, it will be a hurtin. Put DR's on both cars and it will be a wipeout. I can't wait to try out the LC on the GT500. Been a long time since I've been to a drag strip.
 
Okay. Not to take Sam and Kingman away from the gold chains discussion... But I think I may have found my new track car. :biggrin $60K sounds like a bargain. How do we get one? :banana Do you guys think actual selling prices are going to be much higher than that?
 
I wonder how many Boss 302 orders will be cancelled? Too cool your best competition is yourself.
 
Piccola said:
Do you guys think actual selling prices are going to be much higher than that?
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Do ducks have feathers?
 
Empty Pockets said:
Do ducks have feathers?
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I'm from WI. Our ducks don't have feathers. :lol
Duck2.jpg
 
DBK said:
That's why I said I thought it was dumb they were so gung ho on talking ZL1 up as the best thing since sliced bread, specifically related to their competitors. The threads on the Mustang websites aren't nearly as long as the thread on the Camaro site filled with guys explaining how they can upgrade power, next year Chevy will make it faster, is anyone canceling their order, cars are too fast anyways, etc. All before the car ever came out.

Chevy tends to give a pretty good estimate of what their cars will do on a drag strip, and if the 6-speed version using launch control including roll-out will do 12.1@119, it will be a hurtin. Put DR's on both cars and it will be a wipeout. I can't wait to try out the LC on the GT500. Been a long time since I've been to a drag strip.
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I talked with the owner of the largest Chevy dealer in Los Angeles yesterday and he is pissed off and concerned. He moved quite a bit of Camaros last year and ordered even more for this year. Now he is concerned he will be sitting on them and paying unnecessary flooring. He also added that despite all the buzz and Detroit denials, in his case the Camaro has eroded his Corvette sales and with the GT500 news, he is really concerned.
 
I doubt there will be much sales impact overall between the two models, but it definitely makes ZL1 look less appealing relative to GT500. Their performance will be closer than the numbers look, but marketing is important with this stuff and 650 hp is an impressive number.

GM never cares about Corvette right before they change a model. The next Corvette base model has performance pretty close to the current Z06 so they won't be too worried about Camaro/Corvette losses after this next year. I'd be more worried about purely alienating customers with pricing than "which one should I buy conundrums." We're talking about $60k Mustangs and Camaros vs. Corvettes that increasingly reach the 6 figures. The rate at which the price of these toys has increased has far, far outpaced the rate at which the incomes of their potential buyers have increased. Ten years ago these cars were barely half the price they are now.
 
Silverbullitt said:
I wonder how many Boss 302 orders will be cancelled? Too cool your best competition is yourself.
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Two different cars and IMO niche owners.

Sold my GT500 for the Boss as it was not nearly as well balanced and had TOO much power to effectively use. Maybe on a long course the GT500 can run the Boss down just as the GT's did at Miller. But in the twisties, the Boss is equally competitive with both.

But I am glad the GT500 one-uped the Camaro and Chevy dealers/forums are now "worried"!
 
DBK said:
The rate at which the price of these toys has increased has far, far outpaced the rate at which the incomes of their potential buyers have increased. Ten years ago these cars were barely half the price they are now.
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Exactly.

The glaring difference in general between today's "muscle cars" and the corresponding cars of the original muscle car era is the fact that many "average guys" could afford to buy a muscle car back then. In fact, the "average guy" is the one who actually created the muscle car boom. ("Joe" was the very guy to whom those cars were marketed in the 1st place.) But today, no way, Jose. Add the dealer premiums to the mix and it's an absolute impossiblity for Joe Public to own one...unless he's willing to live in a tent.
 
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Interesting comments in this thread regarding the GT500 and it's performance on the track. What Indy wrote mirrors what KP and a few others have said... I got to take the Boss 302 LS on the track and enjoyed just about everything about it. I looked at a few, but each one I looked at was around $50-$55K, which I thought was high. Although I'm not a Corvette fan, I took the Corvette on the track (base model - nothing fancy) and it handled quite well. I'm looking at the GT500's but haven't taken one on the track - just talked with people about it's handling. Clearly I have much less track experience and skill than many of you, but if you were looking for a track car, would 650 hp on a Mustang be too dangerous given it's limitations?
 
Piccola, I very much enjoy tracking all my cars. The FGT got me started for as we all know that was why this vehicle was born. Well maybe centennial celebration had something to do with it as well. The track heritage of the FGT speaks for itself. The design team gave us all one heck of a track superstar.

The GT500 was added for "street fun" and at 500 hp (2007) was usually unbeatable. And at $35-45K much more approachable and obtainable by "Joe" (see above thread). I did not have to worry about the Mustang nearly as much as the FGT leaving it parked at an event, and the GT500 could be replaced if necessary as it was still in production. The FGT always turns heads, and the GT500 does also but to a slightly lesser extent.

So tracking was started in the FGT and moved to the Mustang for additional fun. The mustang was different. Much heavier all around and significantly more so with the iron block 5.4 and supercharger in front. I was much more reliant on the brakes which taught me my first lesson in brake fluid boiling. I was learning.

I made the leap to the Boss for three reasons: 1) one-third the liability of the GT in an incident, 2) Lighter, aluminum 5.0 Roadrunner track inspired engine normally aspirated, and 3) the promise from Ford engineers this was the best live axle Mustang to ever be developed. The 5 FGT owners who brought their Bosses to Miller this year had a great time on the track with other GT's. The Boss is stellar in track performance and is a blast to drive. Ask Ron-the-Rocketman what he thinks. Unfortunately delivery of his LS did not give him time to take it to Miller with the GT's.

While I am sure you could have a great time on the track with the new super powerful GT500, at 444hp, a track-tuned suspension, significantly lighter and less costly (you can probably get a '12 Boss for around $42K), IMO starting out tracking a fun car, the Boss is hard to beat. And you would have the extra $10-15K for track time instruction and Hoosiers!:biggrin
 
Piccola said:
Interesting comments in this thread regarding the GT500 and it's performance on the track. What Indy wrote mirrors what KP and a few others have said... I got to take the Boss 302 LS on the track and enjoyed just about everything about it. I looked at a few, but each one I looked at was around $50-$55K, which I thought was high. Although I'm not a Corvette fan, I took the Corvette on the track (base model - nothing fancy) and it handled quite well. I'm looking at the GT500's but haven't taken one on the track - just talked with people about it's handling. Clearly I have much less track experience and skill than many of you, but if you were looking for a track car, would 650 hp on a Mustang be too dangerous given it's limitations?
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Just remember MJ, the car is always faster than the driver.

Keep in mind that "the performance numbers" have nothing to do with driver enjoyment. Find a car you like, one that you are comfortable in, has good ergonomics and superior visability. And enjoy it as often as you can.

For all the 'hot-shoe" folks, that spew all of the bar talk, keep in mind most of them are just talking (or writing) outloud. As you have noticed the folks on this forum actually drive their cars and they tell it truthfully like it is. Good advice availiable here, that generally is not found on other forums or blogs.

The adage of "so many choices, so little time or money" applies to track cars. You've got to decide whether you want a track only car or one that you occasionally will play with on the track. Huge difference between the two.

Hope to see you out west real soon.

Jeff
 
I just watched Ron's video from the Boss 302 (more fun than reading articles) Yeah, he drives just a "little" bit better than me. LOL The new GT500 sounds exciting, but I don't see myself getting bored with either, and the Boss 302 would probably be better for me as I work on bumping up my skills. Thanks Jeff and Bill.
 
 
ATTN: Now accepting donations to the "Stef get's a 13 GT500 Fund" . Thrill rides will be free to all who participate. :lol :rofl:leaving:
 
And now from the competitor - open letter, response to Camaro Nation re: Ford GT500 from Camaro Chief Engineer.

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182774
 
Cobrar said:
And now from the competitor - open letter, response to Camaro Nation re: Ford GT500 from Camaro Chief Engineer.

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182774
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I hope they know how funny the guys at Ford find that. I made sure to send it to everyone yesterday and the responses ranged from "sad but predictable" to "what a joke."

The only thing they cling to is Nurburgring times, which are useless in the real world, and GT500 may well beat anyways. GT500 is faster, quicker and is already faster than ZL1 at a track in the US many of us have been to. Oh, and it avoids gas guzzler.
 
As you have pointed out, from a product positioning perspective GM has a huge problem, and have painted themselves into a corner with the Camaro and Vette offerings. Worse, they can't seem to look into the marketplace and position w/respect to their competition either. But, I have to give the guy credit, a response of some sort was necessary, and he did a fair job of 'spinning' the facts.
 
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