Why tax cuts are a losing issue.

[ChipBeck]

Tax day is tomorrow. It use to be a day when most Americans got at least a little upset at their tax bill and wished for a tax cut, but not any more. We have made our income tax system so "progressive" that according to todays Wall Street Journal, 60% of Americans pay less than 1% of all income taxes. The other 40% of taxpayers pay 99.1% of the income taxes. So there will never be a time when a majority of tax payers get fed up with high taxes. A majority now pay no taxes and want to see "the rich" pay even more. The top 1% make 16.3% of the nations income but pay 37% of the nations income tax. "If, as now happens, 60% of the people in our democracy can force 40% to pay the bills, what's to stop 65% from making 35% pay it all? Or 90% from making 10% pay it all?":bored (WSJ) .......and justice for all??? This is what my mama called "robbing Peter to pay Paul". Which is never a good idea since it makes Peter mad. And it's hard to do much of anything with a sore Peter.:ack Jokes aside, this current unjust system is not sustainable. And we hear the drumbeat from the numerically illiterate in Congress that taxes on the "rich" should be raised so they pay their "fair share". They never define what precisely the "fair share" is except to say that it's more than it is now. I'll feel great tomorrow as I write the 6 figure check knowing that 60% of my fellow countrymen will be paying nothing.

Chip

 

[Empty Pockets]

Tax day is tomorrow. It use to be a day when most Americans got at least a little upset at their tax bill and wished for a tax cut, but not any more. We have made our income tax system so "progressive" that according to todays Wall Street Journal, 60% of Americans pay less than 1% of all income taxes. The other 40% of taxpayers pay 99.1% of the income taxes. So there will never be a time when a majority of tax payers get fed up with high taxes. A majority now pay no taxes and want to see "the rich" pay even more. The top 1% make 16.3% of the nations income but pay 37% of the nations income tax. "If, as now happens, 60% of the people in our democracy can force 40% to pay the bills, what's to stop 65% from making 35% pay it all? Or 90% from making 10% pay it all?":bored (WSJ) .......and justice for all??? This is what my mama called "robbing Peter to pay Paul". Which is never a good idea since it makes Peter mad. And it's hard to do much of anything with a sore Peter.:ack Jokes aside, this current unjust system is not sustainable. And we hear the drumbeat from the numerically illiterate in Congress that taxes on the "rich" should be raised so they pay their "fair share". They never define what precisely the "fair share" is except to say it more than it is now. I'll feel great tomorrow as I write the 6 figure check knowing that 60% of my fellow countrymen will be paying nothing.

Chip

And, have you noticed, Chip, that nobody on the "left" seems to be able to define at what point "rich" begins? My own theory is: that figure will placed wherever it's needed at any given time.

The income tax gouge has become farrrrrrr different from what we were "promised" when it first began. (Surprise, surprise.:bs )

 

[dbk]

I'm pretty happy to have hit the "submit" button that made my money disappear :bored

 

[B O N Y]

I am in mourning...
Bony a forty percenter...

 

[Eric Brooks]

I had to file an extension, I owe a bunch :-(

If you really wanna get pissed at the Gov't, check this link out.. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4312730277175242198

 

[Empty Pockets]

I had to file an extension, I owe a bunch :-(

If you really wanna get pissed at the Gov't, check this link out.. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4312730277175242198

I read a "debunking" of the premise that not enough states had ratified the income tax... but, I'll be darned if I can remember where.

In any event, it'd take a constitutional scholar with a "large pair" to validate that agrument (income tax = illegal) & present it before anyone or any "body" that'll change the status quo.

One of the arguments validating the "legality" of the 'tax is the fact that it's been around long enough to have the "effect" of law regardless.

'Bottom line: we're screwed. (Does that surprise anyone?:shrug )

 

[Neilda]

If it's of any comfort - taxation is an equally unpleasant topic over here too.

Here's a good one in the UK, we pay 'Council Tax' which is an annual house tax and is supposed to pay for local services (none of which I use by the way). It's priced on the value of your home.

If you improve your house (add a new kitchen for example) your Council Tax increases. If you have your garden landscaped - your tax increases. Of course all of the work you pay for is from net income and the builders have to pay tax too.

And then there's the car taxes - tax on fuel here is nearly 90%, it's about $10 a gallon here of which $9 is tax (roughly). Then there's a daily $16 charge to drive into London. Now there's the 'Road Pricing Scheme' where each car will be fitted with a tracker and you'll pay a toll for every mile you drive....

Oh - National Insurance of 11% of gross income on top of the 40% income tax! This goes to pay for hospitals. But I use private health care - but am not exempt from paying it, however I am taxed on my private health care as it's a benefit.

Blood pressure rising.................

Breathe deeeeeeply............ and .............. relax...............


:ack

 

[fjpikul]

Neilda, please don't forget the ever popular VAT.

 

[Empty Pockets]

Sooooooooooo ...having read that, Neilda ...why don't I feel any better about the stinkin' check I just sent in to Uncle Sam???????:confused :confused :confused

 

[BlackICE]

I had to file an extension, I owe a bunch :-(

If you really wanna get pissed at the Gov't, check this link out.. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4312730277175242198

Most of the people interviewed in the film are in JAIL!

Schiff got 30 years!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irwin_Schiff

Legal, or not you have to pay your taxes, I know I do. I support many families besides my own.

 

[B O N Y]

. I support many families besides my own.

YOUR THE MAN! Can I send you my bills as well?:cheers :lol :cheers

 

[Neilda]

Sooooooooooo ...having read that, Neilda ...why don't I feel any better about the stinkin' check I just sent in to Uncle Sam???????:confused :confused :confused

At least you're not alone - I feel your pain!

 

[sharp33]

If it's of any comfort - taxation is an equally unpleasant topic over here too.

...If you improve your house (add a new kitchen for example) your Council Tax increases. If you have your garden landscaped - your tax increases. Of course all of the work you pay for is from net income and the builders have to pay tax too.
...
Oh - National Insurance of 11% of gross income on top of the 40% income tax! This goes to pay for hospitals. But I use private health care - but am not exempt from paying it, however I am taxed on my private health care as it's a benefit.

No doubt the UK sounds even worse than here, but don't forget you've been around longer. We'll catch up soon. We pay real estate and school taxes that go up everytime we improve our property. And once we have HiliaryCare we'll also have to pay for National Health Insurance too either separately or as part of an income tax increase. If we're lucky we'll be able to pay even more to opt out and get good care. But superior private insurance is already provided for all of the legislators free of charge, so to be "fair" to the economically challenged, the rest of us probably will not have any choice other than what the government provides for the masses.

 

[Empty Pockets]

At least you're not alone - I feel your pain!

Thank you, Sir - and right back atcha!

Honest to Pete, I don't see how you folks over there keep your heads above water.

Have you considered a revolution? It worked for us ... up until about 30 yrs ago. :bang :bang :bang

 

[Empty Pockets]

Then there's a daily $16 charge to drive into London.
:ack

As was accurately pointed out elsewhere on this thread - WE'RE CATCHING UP TO YOU.

The mayor of New York has just announced a proposal to slap an $8 "fee" (read that TAX) for a one way "pass" to drive into Manhattan!!!!!!

I wonder if he's been getting his ideas from your posts, Neilda????

 

[Neilda]

I think he's been getting his ideas from Ken Livingstone - London's bicycling left wing Mayor.

Everyone in the UK has leapt aboard the Carbon bandwaggon - drive a car and you're basically strangling baby foxes, stabbing dolphins and killing the sky. This also fuels, to some extent, the class prejudices in the UK, i.e. big car = wealth. Die, die die. Little cutsie car = the wigwam living, lentil-eating, bearded Lesbian. Take more benefits and go straight to the front of the queue for tax breaks.

 

[B O N Y]

I think he's been getting his ideas from Ken Livingstone - London's bicycling left wing Mayor.

Everyone in the UK has leapt aboard the Carbon bandwaggon - drive a car and you're basically strangling baby foxes, stabbing dolphins and killing the sky. This also fuels, to some extent, the class prejudices in the UK, i.e. big car = wealth. Die, die die. Little cutsie car = the wigwam living, lentil-eating, bearded Lesbian. Take more benefits and go straight to the front of the queue for tax breaks.

Neil, I am a LESBIAN and would appreciate it if you would not pick on the sisterhood.:cheers :lol :eek :cheers

 

[Fubar]

...And we hear the drumbeat from the numerically illiterate in Congress that taxes on the "rich" should be raised so they pay their "fair share". They never define what precisely the "fair share" is except to say that it's more than it is now. I'll feel great tomorrow as I write the 6 figure check knowing that 60% of my fellow countrymen will be paying nothing....

This is a good point but don’t forget who is elected to congress (and the white house for that matter). The "rich" however you define rich. If this were not the case, the wealthy would have lost a long time ago.

I think the problem is corruption, our politicians funding ridiculous programs to line the pockets of their constituents. IMHO

 

[Empty Pockets]

This also fuels, to some extent, the class prejudices in the UK, i.e. big car = wealth. Die, die die.

This appears to be a rampant sentiment pretty much everywhere. I've been "confronted"(?) by representitives of this group (haven't we all) regarding cars of mine a time or two over the years. But, surprisingly, not with the GT...yet.

A faction of his same crowd was calling for Bill Gates' financial head a couple years back because THEY decided he had too much money for one man and "there oughta be a law" ...blah, blah, blah. 'Wonder if they realize he's done more good with his wealth than the government EVER would have? (Not to mention all the wealth he's created for others along the way.)

 

[Neilda]

Neil, I am a LESBIAN and would appreciate it if you would not pick on the sisterhood.:cheers :lol :eek :cheers

I have often been tempted by the whole Lesbian thing and was, for many years, a practising Lesbian. I may go back to it but would probably start by being a spectator for a while. :wink