Whipple vs twin turbo ??
- Thread starter stevo
- Start date
Whipple... especially to meet your "lower RPM range" P&T requirements.
Supposedly, you'll see a 200 rwhp gain with the 19lb pulley installed (with a tune, etc., acc'ding to Whipple's website).)
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For some, keeping a SC on the car keeps it more original '05-'06. The Turbos will provide more power if 200 additional HP from the Whipple isn't enough on pump gas. 200 more HP with turbos is very conservative. You can run straight exhaust with no muffler/cats with the turbos and the sound is not offensive because of the quieting effect of the turbos. Both systems are equally streetable and both bolt on/bolt off and can easily be returned to original. The least expensive turbo set up is about $25,000. There is no bad choice here, it's pretty subjective depending upon what you want and what you are willing to pay.
No offense intended here to anyone, but I'm just wondering this morning...
Why is the TT system for the GT so expensive? Seems to me, it is fairly easy to install, parts involved can't be much more than any other TT system (for a Mustang for instance) and the reflash for the ECM should also be pretty straight forward. I'd think for about $10K or so, you could build up a very nice TT system for the GT, particularly since we already have the i'-cooler in place.
Have TT development costs been that high? Are so few owners doing the conversion and that's keeping the prices up there? Is this just another example of the GT tax? maybe it's just the rarity of the car and potential customers for the system...and economy of scale type thing (or lack there of), or Am I just a tight ass? (yes)
and it's not just the TT systems, it's parts for the whole car in general. The only thing I've found reasonable in cost so far has been the oil filter.
I guess it kinda' like having surgery, when you're going under the knife, you don't look for the cheapest price... and therefore, when you're modding a $150K car, a few extra bucks for the expertise of a Jason Heffner or the Stage 6 boys is a small price to pay for peace of mind when you step on the go pedal.
Anyway, I'd like to hear some thoughts from y'all on this topic.
mardyn
Why is the TT system for the GT so expensive? Seems to me, it is fairly easy to install, parts involved can't be much more than any other TT system (for a Mustang for instance) and the reflash for the ECM should also be pretty straight forward. I'd think for about $10K or so, you could build up a very nice TT system for the GT, particularly since we already have the i'-cooler in place.
Have TT development costs been that high? Are so few owners doing the conversion and that's keeping the prices up there? Is this just another example of the GT tax? maybe it's just the rarity of the car and potential customers for the system...and economy of scale type thing (or lack there of), or Am I just a tight ass? (yes)
and it's not just the TT systems, it's parts for the whole car in general. The only thing I've found reasonable in cost so far has been the oil filter.
I guess it kinda' like having surgery, when you're going under the knife, you don't look for the cheapest price... and therefore, when you're modding a $150K car, a few extra bucks for the expertise of a Jason Heffner or the Stage 6 boys is a small price to pay for peace of mind when you step on the go pedal.
Anyway, I'd like to hear some thoughts from y'all on this topic.
mardyn
Here’s how I see the trade-offs breaking down:
Cost => Whipple advantage
Low-end torque => Whipple advantage
Peak power for given boost => Turbo advantage
Most power for given fuel octane => Turbo advantage
Cost => Whipple advantage
Low-end torque => Whipple advantage
Peak power for given boost => Turbo advantage
Most power for given fuel octane => Turbo advantage
In my opinion if you're out for performance the TT majorly trumps the Whipple. You could probably argue it's better for less shifting with the massive low-end torque, but that torque isn't friendly with 1st and 2nd gear. Obviously it is significantly cheaper, a lot closer to plug and play, and closer to the stock spirit of the car. TT's feel different than the stock car. The Whipple will feel like a GT with the power turned up to 11.
The beauty of a properly sorted Turbo system is that you can manage the power output to make it usable. Having 750-800rwhp with a huge amount of low-end torque is useless in 1st gear on street tires. With the twins you can go 600rwhp in 1st, 750rwhp in 2nd, 900 in 3rd, etc, etc. I drove one of the 800ish rwhp TT cars and it was just as usable as stock, but acceleration was absolutely furious once it got going.
Additionally, a TT car will make much greater power at the same boost level. For example, at 20 psi on 100 octane a TT car made 952rwhp through the stock exhaust. Highest I know of on a Whipple is 771rwhp at about 23psi. You can get in the 700s with the same amount of boost a stock car runs with twins. I'd rather run 15# and get 750 than 22# and 750.
But of course there is the issue of price. You have to pay big bucks for a TT kit. Any tuner taking on the responsibility of screwing around with a 170k car is going to need to make sure it's done exactly right. The stakes are significantly higher when you're dealing with a motor that costs more than a Corvette. Plus, there's the extra hardware and the fabrication and whatnot.
You can't go wrong with either one. Just depends on your goals and budget. Either will haul ass and look good under the clamshell...
The beauty of a properly sorted Turbo system is that you can manage the power output to make it usable. Having 750-800rwhp with a huge amount of low-end torque is useless in 1st gear on street tires. With the twins you can go 600rwhp in 1st, 750rwhp in 2nd, 900 in 3rd, etc, etc. I drove one of the 800ish rwhp TT cars and it was just as usable as stock, but acceleration was absolutely furious once it got going.
Additionally, a TT car will make much greater power at the same boost level. For example, at 20 psi on 100 octane a TT car made 952rwhp through the stock exhaust. Highest I know of on a Whipple is 771rwhp at about 23psi. You can get in the 700s with the same amount of boost a stock car runs with twins. I'd rather run 15# and get 750 than 22# and 750.
But of course there is the issue of price. You have to pay big bucks for a TT kit. Any tuner taking on the responsibility of screwing around with a 170k car is going to need to make sure it's done exactly right. The stakes are significantly higher when you're dealing with a motor that costs more than a Corvette. Plus, there's the extra hardware and the fabrication and whatnot.
You can't go wrong with either one. Just depends on your goals and budget. Either will haul ass and look good under the clamshell...
BlackICE
GT Owner
For those of us in CA, Whipple is the only street legal choice. I was told that the Whipple passed the CARB tests and awaits the final paperwork for CARB approval. That mean 50 state emissions legal! In CA, a turbo would get you in trouble with the smog Nazis.
I generally agree with DBK on the differences, but will add that lack of turbo lag and torque throughout the power band makes the Whipple a better street car for many, notwithstanding the lack of ultimate HP and possible heatsoak. There is something intoxicating about how it pulls in 5th or 6th with just a nudge of the throttle.
I generally agree with DBK on the differences, but will add that lack of turbo lag and torque throughout the power band makes the Whipple a better street car for many, notwithstanding the lack of ultimate HP and possible heatsoak. There is something intoxicating about how it pulls in 5th or 6th with just a nudge of the throttle.
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Gulf GT
GT Owner
Usable HP is another discussion. Bragging rights for 1500Hp is nice, but how you are going to use it will decide if it is worth it to you. Many of the Whipple owners have switched to Hoosiers for everyday street use to solve the laying down of the high torque and are having no problems even in light rain. A higher HP turbo car won't be able to make up what a Whipple car can gain coming out of the corners with higher low end torque on a road coarse, while conversely a Whipple car will never out drag a higher HP turbo car in a quarter mile run. What is your purpose for more HP and how you will use will make your decision. No right or wrong decisions, just different purposes and goals for the car.
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One other point that may or may not matter to you, stevo: should you ever desire to do so, the Whipple is as easy to swap back out as it was to install in the 1st place ... simply take off single item "A" and put on single item "B". (Assuming you don't go the headers/cat back route too.)
Depending on what was done to go the turbo route, going back to "stock" pbly wouldn't be that simple.:shrug
Depending on what was done to go the turbo route, going back to "stock" pbly wouldn't be that simple.:shrug
