A unique starting problem?

[Vincent998]

Well, I found my starting problem, and it may be unique. However, I suggest all GT owners check for this issue the next time they have the rear pan off.

I installed a new battery and charged it overnight before using it, cleaned the ground, etc. Car still did not start, but the solenoid clicked. I removed the rear pan so I could get at the starter and discovered that, when I gently pulled on the power cable to the solenoid, it fell off! The bend at the angle of the fixing tab was completely cracked through! Further examination suggests that the cable, which is firmly cable tied to the frame, had not been given enough freedom to move when the motor rocks on its mounts, so that over time (30,000 miles) the steel right angle fitting on the end of the cable failed at the bend. See the attached photos. The orange line at the failure point is rust, and you can see some darker discoloration (from carrying so much current) where the last remaining point of attachment was. Now I need to find a suitable tab that I can solder or crimp to the cable. Of course this has to be done while the cable is in the car ….

 

[jaxgt]

Similar thing happened to me two weeks ago. Cable came right off solenoid. Exhaust heat probably contributed to mine

 

[Vincent998]

Similar thing happened to me two weeks ago. Cable came right off solenoid. Exhaust heat probably contributed to mine

Exactly what happened (did the wires come out of the fitting or what?) and how did you fix it?

 

[jaxgt]

Wire completely disconnected from solenoid. Clip partially melted. Bought new starter/solenoid (all in one) and installed. Wrapped nearby exhaust with heat shield tape and had small heat shield fabricated in metal

 

[Specracer]

Lucky it didnt brake and ground out, as that is a non fused circuit direct from the battery.

My solenoid connector has experienced heat too (melted), a while back, I installed a flexible insulation blanket.

 

[Vincent998]

Wire completely disconnected from solenoid. Clip partially melted. Bought new starter/solenoid (all in one) and installed. Wrapped nearby exhaust with heat shield tape and had small heat shield fabricated in metal

If I understand correctly, you are talking about the plastic clip and the single small gauge wire, not the heavy wire (4 ga?) with the stud fitting at the end. My fitting is broken at the angle. and the only factory replacement would be a new wiring harness. Buying a new starter/solenoid would not make any difference in solving the problem. I need a way to replace the fitting (see photos).

 

[jaxgt]

Was the heavy wire. Fortunately I guess plug broke on solenoid, where wire plugs in. Wire was fine.

 

[HighHP]

Google "copper wire lug". These solder very nice. Solder onto wire, cover with two layers of heat shrink tubing. If wire is not long enough, may need to add a few inches of new wire to the wire lug and splice at a convienent point up stream. Or find a starter wire or other wire with a similar lug and splice it into the wireloom at a convienent point up stream.

 

[twobjshelbys]

Wow, good catch. And someone else that's not afraid to work on the car! It's just a Ford

 

[Vincent998]

Google "copper wire lug". These solder very nice. Solder onto wire, cover with two layers of heat shrink tubing. If wire is not long enough, may need to add a few inches of new wire to the wire lug and splice at a convienent point up stream. Or find a starter wire or other wire with a similar lug and splice it into the wireloom at a convienent point up stream.

After more investigation, I found that this is not a good option. The battery/starter cable is actually two cables run in the same sheath (you can see the ends on the broken fitting) and to splice them together to a single cable would require a "Y" fitting and a larger cable gauge to handle the increased amperage. I found the part number for the complete cable, which is 4G7Z-14300-AA, and it runs all the way from the positive terminal of the battery to the starter solenoid. To change the cable it looks as though I would have to remove not only the two rear pans but also the left side pan next to the fuel tank cover and possibly the front air dam. That's assuming that there are no complications in removing the old cable and running a new one. To judge from the photos/drawings of the cable that I found on line, the new cable does not have the 90 degree bend where the fitting broke, but is straight instead.

Has anyone ever replaced this cable?

 

[soroush]

of course you can splice them together to a single cable just make sure its a heavier gauge cable,, your picture also shows both cables (if there are in fact two) spliced together and both being crimped on by one lug its just a professionally crimped lug that ends in two loops... you can try to pry it open and discard the broken part and replace it with a new lug. if there is enough slack in the cable no need to add any cable to it at all just reattach it. either way the lugs are your best bet.. I would not replace the whole cable.

 

[nota4re]

To judge from the photos/drawings of the cable that I found on line, the new cable does not have the 90 degree bend where the fitting broke, but is straight instead.

There are many examples where the depiction of the part in the manual or parts catalog is incorrect. I would bet that the new part is identical to the old part.

And, you are absolutely right about this cable going directly to the battery - so be extra cautious, i.e., keep the cable disconnected at the battery and re-connect only as a last step. A little curious why Ford chose not to employ a fusible link somewhere close to the battery. If that cable were to short out, the chance of an entire vehicle fire would be quite high.

 

[HighHP]

Interesting timing. I removed my pan the day before you posted this. Planning to change all fluids. I got looking close to that exact cable that is wire tied tight to the frame. Then a short distance away it is attached to the starter, which moves with the engine. Creating high stress on the cable. I was planning to take a closer look at this. I definitely will now. I wonder if removing the wire tie to the frame would be a good idea?

 

[HighHP]

If you do splice here are some good splice devices, just need to get the right size. The elecdirect site even shows a 90 degree lug that might work to the starter if needed.

- Copper tube or copper pipe if you can find one that fits, then cover with a couple layers of heat shrink, DON'T forget to install heat shrink before soldering, or

Lugs and Splices | Compression Connectors | ElecDirect

Shop our selection of aluminum and copper compression wire lugs and splices. UL Listed and CSA certified cable lugs and compression connectors.

www.elecdirect.com

Short-Barrel Splice, Yellow, 4/0 AWG Wire Gauge, Die Code: 4/2, 2.08" Length

Short-Barrel Splice, 2.08 in., Yellow

www.grainger.com

#2 - 4/0 AWG In-Line Gel Splice Kit with Connector, Black ESGS-4/0 - The Home Depot

NSI easy-splice in-line gel splice kit provides a sealed splice for underground, buried and overhead applications. This in-line closure offers a fast and simple method for splicing, insulating and environmentally

www.homedepot.com

ASI 2/0-1 AWG Inline Splice Connector, Insulated, Black AICD2/0-1 - The Home Depot

AICD2-0-1 is an insulated inline splice connector made from high strength 6061-T6 aluminum, dipped in black dielectric plastisol and prefilled with an oxide inhibitor to prevent rusting. Plugs are marked

www.homedepot.com

 

[Vincent998]

Interesting timing. I removed my pan the day before you posted this. Planning to change all fluids. I got looking close to that exact cable that is wire tied tight to the frame. Then a short distance away it is attached to the starter, which moves with the engine. Creating high stress on the cable. I was planning to take a closer look at this. I definitely will now. I wonder if removing the wire tie to the frame would be a good idea?

It's my plan (after repairs) to cut at least the cable tie closest to the starter to give the wire some ability to move. I don't know how much, but I suspect I'll retie it, but with some slack. As it is now, there is no give anywhere and those ties are really tight.

In addition, I suggest you look VERY closely at the angle of the tab to see if there is any cracking at the bend. There is a stress point there, where the little extra reinforcement provided in the tab ends. That's exactly where mine broke. I am interested in what you find. As I wrote above, my car has 30K miles on it. How many does yours have?

 

[HighHP]

20,000

 

[Vincent998]

20,000

Thanks! I looked at the lugs from your links. I have been unable to find a "Y" lug similar to the original Ford one. Trying to calculate the current carrying capacity of the single wire fed by both wires is beyond my pay grade. I have some work experience crimping 1/16-1/2" stranded wire lugs and cable fittings, but I do not have the crimpers necessary to firmly and properly attach the crimped lugs to the wire while it's in the car. Therefore, any new lug will have to be soldered, which means putting a lot of heat into the cable ends and undoubtedly damaging some length of the woven cover that protects the wires.

 

[Specracer]

Heavy wire crimpers are not too bad (~$30), sure one time use, but I would do it vs melting the harness.

IWISS Battery Cable Lug Crimping Tool from AWG 8-1/0 with Cable Cutter - - Amazon.com

IWISS Battery Cable Lug Crimping Tool from AWG 8-1/0 with Cable Cutter - - Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

 

[twobjshelbys]

Check Harbor Freight too.

 

[PL510*Jeff]

May Rich can chime in on this, he's seen more GT's apart than anyone.