The new Ford GT: is it worth it?

[AJB]

Dave -that mirrors my thoughts too. Ford should price this new vehicle MSRP in order to make a nice profit on the Product Planning Volume. Don't come back to me 5 years from now and say the car 'did not make a profit" or even worse "did not break even" . You have one opportunity.

After seeing many programs, owning and leasing over 150 Ford Vehicles since 1970, I think an MSRP of $450,000 is fair.
andy (ajb)

 

[dbk]

DBK, in spite of the fact that a low MSRP car could drop the values of existing GTs, wouldn't it be a powerful testament to Fords entire product line that they can produce a car even better than the competition at a significantly lower price point.

PHX is a halo car intended as an exercise in technology and ultimate performance. There is no chance average joe will ever own this car even at a huge discount relative to the segment, so trying to severely undercut a base-MSRP $288k Speciale accomplishes nothing amongst the general consumer population. You either destroy Ferrari or you don't.

If it's a low volume, but still low price release, do you accomplish both goals? Preserve current market value and lore of existing GTs (not that I think this is any manufacturers first priority) while also putting the technology and value on display?

As a dealer, you know there is no such thing as low-volume, low-price with a car like this. There is market value and MSRP. If Ford doesn't price the car at market value, the dealer will.

 

[nemetskii]

To be clear, when I say low price, I mean something along the lines of analogous pricing to the last GT as compared to the ferraris of its day. I think the 0506 gt was roughly 80-90% of the ferraris available at the time. Do you think it's overly optimistic to hope for similar pricing strategy. That is to say, not to severely undercut, but a bit less than a speciale?

 

[dbk]

Not a comparison you can really make because the cars aren't nearly as similar this time. 05/06 and 360 were pretty more similar, not so much this go round.

 

[nemetskii]

Ok, I better start saving, haha. It's for the best because I think I'll have to lose about 50 lbs too. Less food = more money right?!

 

[FENZO]

A couple thoughts:
Personally, I feel an ultra high-performance, high-price, low-volume successor in the lineage is the best-case scenario.

I am a grateful guest in all of this experience. Fortunate beyond belief. But... Ugh - Ford wanting to be, vs beat, Ferrari (or the hyper car du jour) is a punch to the soul. It isn't broke, don't fix it.

I commit too much emotion to this sh!t. Only thing I know for sure.

:frown

 

[2112]

If the market value ends up being expensive, I would rather it go to FoMoCo at MSRP than towards ADM's (to keep performance cars an ongoing concern).

 

[twobjshelbys]

I've pontificated on Total Available Market many times, but I claim Ford bought a portion of the TAM in 2005 and 2006 by undercutting the price of the competition by "just enough". But they made it up in volume (but they really did). So if the real numbers of the new are are real at 1200 total units over 3 to 4 years, the need to be lower than the competition to buy TAM doesn't factor. The competition is in the 300-350K-is number, and I predict his one will be closer to 350K than 200K. Even a 2005-2006 Ford GT in today's money is closer to 250K. And they have a whole boatload of tooling to amortize. Expecting a 200K MSRP is only possible in Colorado and Washington. Trust me, the cost of options on this car are going to be astronomic. Who else did, could and will charge $5000 for a radio?

I'd love to be wrong so I could buy two.

Edit:

I'll add that there is a monkey wrench that could happen. Everyone hopes for an opportunity to introduce a disruptive product, and the one looming over Ford on the GT is the potential for a mid-engine Corvette. While not likely a Le Mans GTE class competitor (since they are designed for the consumer to be cheap) it would be a market play and would be a TAM play.

 

[nemetskii]

I just really don't think that the proper weighting is being given to overall brand image. 100,000 additional profit per carx300 cars a year is 30 mil/year. Ford is a roughly 5 billion pre Tax profit company. I think that even a small uptick in brand respect based on putting out a car that crushes competition at a discount is more important than any additional revenue they bring in based on pricing. I think Toyota made that exact mistake when they priced LFA too high. I think there would have been a significantly larger buzz around the car had it been priced more conservatively. Even if it results in ADMs, I don't think thats necessarily a bad thing. And I'm not saying that because I'm a dealer. I think that, in general, people feel ADMs to be distasteful not because they are paying more, but because they are concerned they're paying more than other consumers. In other words, I'm afraid some people won't pay that additional markup so I hate that I have to. If the car is priced lower than you guys anticipate, the price including an ADM could very well be less than you're hoping for. Additionally, because the supply is so limited, everyone pays it, eliminating the fear of getting a worse deal than your buddy who buys a month or two later. This also keeps true market value relatively high, not affecting current 0506 GTs. Finally, because the actual MSRP itself is actually relatively moderate, Ford has the credibility of pointing out its delivery of price vs performance. Now is this me trying to set the stage for a huge adm? No, I don't think the allocation will be big enough for it to really even matter, I just think that there is something to be said for that showcase of technology being at least somewhat imaginable to the average ford customer.

 

[Mullet]

Make 700-800 a year and sticker of $299 plus options. Done deal and right in the middle of the dartboard.

 

[B.M.F.]

PHX is a halo car intended as an exercise in technology and ultimate performance. There is no chance average joe will ever own this car even at a huge discount relative to the segment, so trying to severely undercut a base-MSRP $288k Speciale accomplishes nothing amongst the general consumer population. You either destroy Ferrari or you don't.



As a dealer, you know there is no such thing as low-volume, low-price with a car like this. There is market value and MSRP. If Ford doesn't price the car at market value, the dealer will.

BINGO!!! No reason in the world FORD should msrp this car at 300 and dealers sell for 450-500k...

 

[B.M.F.]

I just really don't think that the proper weighting is being given to overall brand image. 100,000 additional profit per carx300 cars a year is 30 mil/year. Ford is a roughly 5 billion pre Tax profit company. I think that even a small uptick in brand respect based on putting out a car that crushes competition at a discount is more important than any additional revenue they bring in based on pricing. I think Toyota made that exact mistake when they priced LFA too high. I think there would have been a significantly larger buzz around the car had it been priced more conservatively. Even if it results in ADMs, I don't think thats necessarily a bad thing. And I'm not saying that because I'm a dealer. I think that, in general, people feel ADMs to be distasteful not because they are paying more, but because they are concerned they're paying more than other consumers. In other words, I'm afraid some people won't pay that additional markup so I hate that I have to. If the car is priced lower than you guys anticipate, the price including an ADM could very well be less than you're hoping for. Additionally, because the supply is so limited, everyone pays it, eliminating the fear of getting a worse deal than your buddy who buys a month or two later. This also keeps true market value relatively high, not affecting current 0506 GTs. Finally, because the actual MSRP itself is actually relatively moderate, Ford has the credibility of pointing out its delivery of price vs performance. Now is this me trying to set the stage for a huge adm? No, I don't think the allocation will be big enough for it to really even matter, I just think that there is something to be said for that showcase of technology being at least somewhat imaginable to the average ford customer.

There is NOTHING cool about the LFA... it could be 150k and i would never ever own one.. Many will agree that car does nothing for so many people..

 

[Sinovac]

LFA what? Toyota might as well have included a Klingon cloaking device as a standard feature.

 

[Kayvan]

Many say LFA sounds like NSX, but not as fun.

 

[texas mongrel]

There is NOTHING cool about the LFA... it could be 150k and i would never ever own one.. Many will agree that car does nothing for so many people..

The noise it makes is fabulous, old-style F1

 

[dbk]

Yup. LFA noise in a more exciting package would have been worth the MSRP. Stunning sound.