So What the Heck Makes a Car "Collectible"?

[w. mitty]

I presume that many of my GT brethren have owned more than just one sports car. Some of these come and go without creating much of a stir, while others leave a profound impression. I think its pretty safe to say that the GT defines that latter. I've been reflecting on this lately, and it has caused me to wonder what specific qualities make it,and a select few other cars throughout history, desirable to the point that they are labeled as "collectible".

Of course, the easiest answer is that rarity plays a big part in the analysis, but I don't think I've ever wanted a car simply because they didn't build many of them. Heck, they could have built only one Pontiac Aztec and it would have been one too many. So, what is it that makes a car collectible?

Oh, and lest I be misunderstood, I have no interest in a discussion of buying cars as an investment, as this is, 99% of time, pure and utter nonsense. I'm posing the question more from the perspective of a sincere car guy, not a speculator or a pretty boy poseur.

 

[RALPHIE]

I presume that many of my GT brethren have owned more than just one sports car. Some of these come and go without creating much of a stir, while others leave a profound impression. I think its pretty safe to say that the GT defines that latter. I've been reflecting on this lately, and it has caused me to wonder what specific qualities make it,and a select few other cars throughout history, desirable to the point that they are labeled as "collectible".

Of course, the easiest answer is that rarity plays a big part in the analysis, but I don't think I've ever wanted a car simply because they didn't build many of them. Heck, they could have built only one Pontiac Aztec and it would have been one too many. So, what is it that makes a car collectible?

Oh, and lest I be misunderstood, I have no interest in a discussion of buying cars as an investment, as this is, 99% of time, pure and utter nonsense. I'm posing the question more from the perspective of a sincere car guy, not a speculator or a pretty boy poseur.

I think one of the attributes to immortality involves a timeless design. Certain vehicles, e.g. Jaguar D-Type, Ford GT40/GT, Austin-Healey, Mercedes 300SL (coupe), Ferrari 250 GTO or 250 Testa Rossa, Aston-Martin DB5, Maserati Tipo 61, Scarab, Porsche RSK or RS-60, etc., convey a look and feel that elevates them to a timeless sensation. No matter the age of the vehicle, they purvey a timeless beauty, that will capture the eye, heart and soul of a lover of automobile design, past, present and future.

Beauty, of course, is what is captured in the eye of the beholder - and when a vehicle commands the beholding of the eyes of so many people, it becomes an art object to be either desired or observed.

 

[RALPHIE]

At the 1962 German Grand Prix (at the Nürburring), in the preliminary GT race, I shot this photo of the 1st Ferrrari 250 GTO that I had ever seen - I was in love with the car from the 1st moment. (Please excuse the dated aging of the Extachrome film, prior to digitizing, and the slowness of my camera at the time)

View attachment 31380​

PS - it won the race! I find it gratifying that a recent sale set the record at $52 million.

 

[Cobrar]

Appreciation on at least two levels!

 

[GT35065]

I was trying to put in to words what I felt after reading the original post and Ralphie explained it perfectly. A timeless design that stands the test of time, and racing history certainly helps the case. For me the GT40 and the AC Cobra is just timeless and from an era I was a part of. The Ford GT captures everything that was awe inspiring in a modern package with the same captivating looks as the original. I guess I am Ford biased, but the GT350's from 65-66 are another classic that speaks to me. 65-67 Corvette, especially roadsters, same deal, just a timeless design.

 

[598]

Dear w. mitty,
Although I respect what the rest of the board may write in response to your question, I suspect no one on this board could respond to your query as proficiently as yourself. When I saw the tag line I couldn't wait to open it to see what you had written. After all the responses are in, please submit your own. I assure you there will be a following awaiting the read.

Steve

 

[Kayvan]

Iacocca said it best:

"A car you can drive to the drag-strip Fri night; the country club Sat night and church Sunday"

 

[Fast Freddy]

i asked Craig Jackson what the # 1 factor is in determining a cars value. he said "rarity"

 

[pvgtX2]

When I hear the word "collectible," I think there is definitely an inference on value and potential appreciation. To me, desirability and collectibility are two totally different things. The comments above sum it up pretty nicely. Most cars that become collectible have the following elements in common: (timeless design, rarity, and often times an additional uniqueness that adds to their rarity- such as ownership history, race history, etc)

The most interesting part of your post I thought was the reference to a "sincere car guy" vs a poseur. I like reading posts on this forum because I think the ratio of sincere car guys to poseurs is pretty high. Some of the people I know who own the most collectible of collectible cars are absolute and utter poseurs. They just have an incredible amount of money and in some cases feel the insatiable need to be more complete by adding a car to their collection that gives them additional legitimacy. Also, I generally agree that new cars are usually pretty poor investments, but in the case of the GTO mentioned above, or some of the other enzo era ferraris, in the absence of a global economic calamity, I believe it to be a sure bet that these values will continue to rise. To me the reason has more to do with generation of extreme global wealth over the past several years and the simple intersection of the supply and demand curve.

What makes the FGT unique and desirable to me is that it seems to have the appropriate amount (not too much, not too little) of all the qualities that appeals to my senses. The beauty in design is undeniable, the historical significance- same. The amount of power and low end torque, and finally ease and comfort of driving. It just seems to have the perfect combination of everything. My first car at the age of 16 was a 1988 Mustang GT. I often wonder if there is some other subliminal connection to that which also makes me love this car?

 

[twobjshelbys]

For the ford gt right now I would separate collectabity from desirability. I think the gt will be colle table but right now more people want them because they're just so much fun.

 

[Xcentric]

....timeless design....convey a look and feel that elevates them to a timeless sensation. No matter the age of the vehicle, they purvey a timeless beauty, that will capture the eye, heart and soul of a lover of automobile design, past, present and future.

Beauty, of course, is what is captured in the eye of the beholder - and when a vehicle commands the beholding of the eyes of so many people, it becomes an art object to be either desired or observed.

RALPHIE waxes poetic...and nails it for me.

Timeless design is essential and sufficient. Other factors (except for a few outliers) that can generally be grouped under "provenance" (such as racing history, ownership history, technology breakthroughs) may add to collectibility, but are not sufficient in my view if the "timeless design" box is unchecked.

What separates the GT's timeless design from other timeless designs is that, as of 2013 AD, many people who don't know what the car is have difficulty placing it in time. Some think it is a brand new model they have not heard about. Others think it is from the 1960s and may have been freshened with new wheels.

Most collectible cars can fairly easily be pinned down to a narrow slice of time, say a decade. I wonder when that will happen to the GT. To me, the GT takes "timeless" to another level.

 

[Cobrar]

What separates the GT's timeless design from other timeless designs is that, as of 2013 AD, many people who don't know what the car is have difficulty placing it in time. Some think it is a brand new model they have not heard about. Others think it is from the 1960s and may have been freshened with new wheels.

Most collectible cars can fairly easily be pinned down to a narrow slice of time, say a decade. I wonder when that will happen to the GT. To me, the GT takes "timeless" to another level.

Excellent point!

I find it most interesting that the Ford GT has such wide appeal, spanning age and income demographics.

 

[djs]

"PS - it won the race! I find it gratifying that a recent sale set the record at $52 million."

I knew those GTOs had crazy values, but $52MM? That's incredible.

 

[SYCO GT]

http://msn.foxsports.com/speed/cars/cars-vintage-ferrari-sells-for-record-52-million/

 

[roketman]

cult car

If thats a cult car what is this?

 

[SBR]

I always remember what the owner of the Blackhawk collection said years ago about this subject. His reply was that the car must have timeless styling, state of the art performance for its time plus low production numbers.

 

[GTdrummer]

This is hard to answer. There are so many variables.

When I was a baby, my dad took all the cash he had and bought a 57 Thunderbird. I am sure he had no idea it would become a collectible - it just had a huge visceral appeal.

When I was 11 my older brother who was a doctor bought a 67 GTO Vert totally tricked out. He had no idea it would be collectible , it was just visceral.

As a young lawyer I bought a Viper, thinking I had died and gone to heaven. I could have cared less if it would be collectible

When I was an older lawyer, I made a mistake in judgement. I could have fairly easily bought an 05 GT but thought I will wait until it drops in value. I have bought 3 since, all in excess of the original MSRP-- genius.

Now, had Ford continued to make GTs with nannies, I suspect we would be having a very different discussion now. But, they didn't .

I have to say that , I have been blessed to own Ferrraris, a McLaren, very nice German cars etc, but never have I been as impressed with the first drive of a car as the GT. My first thought was " where has this been all my life."

So, collectible -- time always tells. On a personal level, it has to do (for me) with an emotional attachment , not unlike what makes me wanting to keep my first wife, as my only wife.

 

[Sinovac]

Ralphie, Rick and Gary-my sentiments exactly. How cool that Ralphie took the picture of the GTO back in the day. That wasn't a parade lap either.

 

[PL510*Jeff]

I've been following this post and began wondering over the various takes on "collectable".

First question - can a collection be one car? Doubt if there are any GT owners who only have one car - a GT.

Second question - Does collectable have anything to do with valuable? I separate the two, as my "collection" has some not expensive cars in it.

Third Question - there is no third question!

While there are many desirable cars, for me most are a joy to look at, but many seem to be an addition to an art collection.

I'm inclined to follow my dreams and purchase cars that are in my mind are uniquely designed as a vehicle rather than just a nicely designed body.

And the final "kicker" they must be fun to drive.

 

[GT35065]

Good points Jeff. I look at my 1986 Mustang GT Convert which has been highly modified and been in Mustang Monthly Mag in 2000. Bought it new 28 years ago. Is it valuable or collectable? Probably only to me, I've had it as long as my oldest child. It was the coolest car I could afford at the time and it is collectable to me, but not many people. Collectable to one person could be "are you kidding me?" to the next guy.

To your first question, a "collection" seems by definition more than one. The term "collectable" can apply to a single car or object it would seem. Then again WTF do I know, I collected an 86 Mustang:lol