Air-fuel meter comparison


analogdesigner

analogdesigner

GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Nov 15, 2005
951
San Clemente, CA USA
 
Thanks, Jay.

I bought a Innovative Tech. LC-1 to datalog. It is the same as the one tested without the meter. I am pleased it got the highest ratings. I plan to use a SCT XCAL 2 to datalog with it. Installing it pre-cats in place of one of the stock O2 sensors. The LC-1 has two outputs from the same sensor. One is wideband the other simulates the stock narrow band sensor. Then I can log at anytime without taking the car apart.

I ran stranded CAT5e cable from the engine compartment to the drivers foot well. (it is want I had around) The exterior insulation is poor and not heat rated for an engine compartment, but I believe the 8 wires inside have high temperature Teflon insulation. Jay do you think there would be any noises issues in using twisted pair vs. shielded coax for the 02 sensor?
 
o2 sensor noise

BlackICE said:
Thanks, Jay.

I bought a Innovative Tech. LC-1 to datalog. It is the same as the one tested without the meter. I am pleased it got the highest ratings. I plan to use a SCT XCAL 2 to datalog with it. Installing it pre-cats in place of one of the stock O2 sensors. The LC-1 has two outputs from the same sensor. One is wideband the other simulates the stock narrow band sensor. Then I can log at anytime without taking the car apart.

I ran stranded CAT5e cable from the engine compartment to the drivers foot well. (it is want I had around) The exterior insulation is poor and not heat rated for an engine compartment, but I believe the 8 wires inside have high temperature Teflon insulation. Jay do you think there would be any noises issues in using twisted pair vs. shielded coax for the 02 sensor?
Click to expand...
BlackICE,

I just bought the same unit a few weeks ago (naturally, before I ran across the article)! I can usually tell the quality of a product by the way it's packaged. I have spoken to their engineering team and they are on the ball... Today, I just ordered their new direct reading, wide sweep, A/F analog gauge. It's the cat's ass! Like you, I will also be data logging with the same SCT unit that you own. We must living parallel lives!
http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/g3_gauge.php
or
http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/g2_gauge.php

Isn't the cable from the LC-1 long enough as-is?

In regards to the additional wiring, I actually think that the CAT5 cable is an excellent idea. You could put a sheath over the cable to ensure better protection.

Your concerns about o2 sensor noise pickup is very valid. I looked at my LC-1 system and the o2 sensor has a 2 foot long cable which then plugs into the processing module. This part of the cable will have a high impedance line (as you mentioned, the o2 signal), which is the most noise susceptible part of the system. The electrical signals at the output of the module are at a low impedance (buffered), so there shouldn't be a noise pickup problem. If you think that you're going to experience noise, you could put some braided metal shielding over the CAT5 cable and then ground one end to the car's chassis. The twisted-pairs that you mentioned will do a fairly good job of rejecting noise. I don't feel that there will be any problems with the unit as-is. The GT is fairy quiet on electrical impulse noise, probably due to the coil-on-plug ignition system. One other thought, proper grounding is very important to prevent voltage offset errors. Once everything is operational, check the voltages that you will be logging for good agreement with the SCT unit. It's a single-ended world out there...

I am going to weld a pair of SS bungs onto my new exhaust system. This will be after the cats, however, I can null out any offset errors. Bill, "Shadowman" gave me some advice on this matter. I can just drive down the road with the engine operating "closed-loop", then electronically adjust my offset until the gauge reads 14.7 to 1. The readings will be slower due to the effect of the cats.

Keep us posted,

Jay
 
I ordered the lc-1 before I read the article you posted too. I don't have my SCT or lc-1 yet, but they should be on the way. The reason for the cat5 is that what I had around that might work and since I had the tunnel out for the shifter install I put the wires in. I didn't want to take it out again. I ran 2 bundles for 8 pairs in total.

I don't know if there will be any problems with replacing one of the pre-cats with the lc-1, but from what I read it should be OK. Any thoughts on potential problems? If you go the same route you won't have to correct for post cat offset and won't have the lag you are concerned about. Of course I have to be carefull about splicing and soldering the connectors, I would think that the temperatures around the cats can exceed 450F about solder's melting point. Of course the LC-1 controller is there too and it is even more sensitive to heat, being CPU controller.

I am looking into hooking up a Racelogic traction controller also to use the other pairs. Running the wheel sensor output for the Anti-lock brake controller in the front back to the Racelogic unit mount next to the ECU. Would the Cat5e work in this application, or will noise levels in the long run from the front to the rear of the car mask the signals?

Any idea on suppliers for Ford electrical connectors? I would be better to get new connectors rather than hacking the wiring.
 
I have an LC-1 as well and use the xcal2 to log it. lol
 
please elaborate

dgussin1 said:
I have an LC-1 as well and use the xcal2 to log it. lol
Click to expand...
Hi dgussin1,

Could you please elaborate? :confused

Thanks,

Jay
 
analogdesigner said:
Hi dgussin1,

Could you please elaborate? :confused

Thanks,

Jay
Click to expand...

What would you like me to elaborate on? I was simply stating that I too am using the same wideband and same datalogger as you and blackice.
 
dgussin1 said:
What would you like me to elaborate on? I was simply stating that I too am using the same wideband and same datalogger as you and blackice.
Click to expand...

I think Jay is asking about the LOL in your reply. Did you encounter any problems installing the LC-1? I don't think either of us have done the install yet.
 
Lol ???

BlackICE said:
I think Jay is asking about the LOL in your reply. Did you encounter any problems installing the LC-1? I don't think either of us have done the install yet.
Click to expand...
BlackICE,

Thanks, you were right on!

dgussin1's latest reply suggests that everything actually works fine. The LOL was taken as a negative! Everything's okay...
Thanks, Jay
 
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oh, i was LOLing b/c I found irony in the fact that all 3 of us are using the same logger and a/f meter.

You should both check this out. It's what is needed in order to hook the wideband to the xcal.

http://innovatemotorsports.com/resources/Xcal2_tutorial.php
 
Thanks for the link

dgussin1 said:
oh, i was LOLing b/c I found irony in the fact that all 3 of us are using the same logger and a/f meter.

You should both check this out. It's what is needed in order to hook the wideband to the xcal.

http://innovatemotorsports.com/resources/Xcal2_tutorial.php
Click to expand...
Hi dgussin1,

This is good news, so we have an expert in case there is some difficulty! Thanks for the link. Hopefully next week everything will be functional.

Jay
 
Jay, did you get your lc-1 installed yet? I am just in the process of installing it and will let everyone know how it works the the SCT-X2 and Livelink. I mounted the WB O2 sensor to the furthest downstream bung on the driver's side FRPP cat delete pipe. The controller is mounted just behind the rear shock tower. This is as far as the sensor's cable will reach. Then the controllers wiring reaches all the way into where the sub-woofer wiring used to be. I tapped a light blue/orange wire from the main harness in the tunnel for power. This wire is a 15 amp ignition switched circuit that is used to power the 4 stock O2 sensors. Since I won't be using the 2 rearmost O2 sensors when I am using the WB O2, I think it should have plenty of reserve power, need 6 amps worst case. Still need to find a good grounding point and to extend and connect the analog outputs of the controller to dash area. I hope to be completed tomorrow afternoon sometime so that I can fire it up with the Whipple for the 1st time!

From reading about WB O2 sensors. They will die an early death if the heater is not powered and the engine is running, or they the heater is powered up and the O2 is fully hot, before a cold engine is started. Then water from condensation could be blasted into the sensor. So the way I have this wired up, I should never turn the key to ignition on for too long before I actually start a cold engine If I accidently do, I should wait for the sensor to cool down before starting engine. The sensor is mounted in the 12 O'clock position however and this should minimize any water hitting it, but I plan to play it safe.
 
BlackICE said:
Jay, did you get your lc-1 installed yet? I am just in the process of installing it and will let everyone know how it works the the SCT-X2 and Livelink. I mounted the WB O2 sensor to the furthest downstream bung on the driver's side FRPP cat delete pipe. The controller is mounted just behind the rear shock tower. This is as far as the sensor's cable will reach. Then the controllers wiring reaches all the way into where the sub-woofer wiring used to be. I tapped a light blue/orange wire from the main harness in the tunnel for power. This wire is a 15 amp ignition switched circuit that is used to power the 4 stock O2 sensors. Since I won't be using the 2 rearmost O2 sensors when I am using the WB O2, I think it should have plenty of reserve power, need 6 amps worst case. Still need to find a good grounding point and to extend and connect the analog outputs of the controller to dash area. I hope to be completed tomorrow afternoon sometime so that I can fire it up with the Whipple for the 1st time!

From reading about WB O2 sensors. They will die an early death if the heater is not powered and the engine is running, or they the heater is powered up and the O2 is fully hot, before a cold engine is started. Then water from condensation could be blasted into the sensor. So the way I have this wired up, I should never turn the key to ignition on for too long before I actually start a cold engine If I accidently do, I should wait for the sensor to cool down before starting engine. The sensor is mounted in the 12 O'clock position however and this should minimize any water hitting it, but I plan to play it safe.
Click to expand...

I can share that the LM-1 (the LC-1 is the same but intended for hard installation) and SCT's Live Link play very well together.

Once you have it set up and then verified and adjusted for any ground offsets you will find that it provides wonderful consistent data then able to be viewed on one screen which makes the process of tuning and troubleshooting very easy.

All the best

Shadowman
 
Shadowman said:
I can share that the LM-1 (the LC-1 is the same but intended for hard installation) and SCT's Live Link play very well together.

Once you have it set up and then verified and adjusted for any ground offsets you will find that it provides wonderful consistent data then able to be viewed on one screen which makes the process of tuning and troubleshooting very easy.

All the best

Shadowman
Click to expand...

Shadowman, what update speed works best for Livelink? I have the choice of immediate, 12/sec, or 6/sec.
 
BlackICE said:
Shadowman, what update speed works best for Livelink? I have the choice of immediate, 12/sec, or 6/sec.
Click to expand...

I tried it a few ways and ultimately came back to the suggestion made by another; 12/sec and it records perfectly and then when used with in LiveLink (if you have not done so already) select the items to monitor including your soon to be defined Analog input and then save the configuration file then each time you want to data log it is very easy.

Takes care

Shadowman
 
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