Attention K-Mart Shoppers

[eshrink]

The dealer from whom my wife purchased her Viper also sells GT's. Our intent was to trade back with him, but his GT market was so strong that he was getting 10s of grand above MSRP. We, alas, went elsewhere.

I was told today that his GT market is gone. There is no interest whatsoever at MSRP...then again, there is even less interest in the Viper.

The Shelby Mustang has been launched and the Camaro Convertible has been announced.

I am not certain that the American public is receptive to muscle cars right now (henceforth?), but I do anticipate that GT prices will tumlbe substantially. That sounds grim for us (although you do not truly lose money until you sell), but it is arguably more grim for those who paid 1 1/2 times what we did for the car.

In other news, the stock market looks just peachy as well.

- doc

 

[nota4re]

Hey doc,

First, I wouldn't put a whole lot of credibility in any one dealer's asessment of the market based on his own geographic experience. The fact that both the Camaro and Shelby Mustang have just launched seems to suggest that there is, in fact, a muscle car market. (Heck, have the Big 3 ever guessed wrong on market trends?)

Finally, I don't think that either the Shelby or Camaro are in the same buyer profile segment and are therefore not serious alternatives for potential GT purchasers.

I think the GT prices will remain somewhat steady at +/- $3000 of MSRP throughout the summer with a push from the stop of production. I think prices will soften as winter kicks in and dealers don't want to sit on a GT through several months of poor weather.

 

[eshrink]

Of course, you are completely correct. I was just struck by how his business fell off so abruptly. And I certainly did not have any difficulty finding GTs at MSRP and below. One woman (dealer) offered me one due to arrive in late June for $156k delivered to my door.

Indeed, I receive a couple of e-mail per week asking if I still want their GT.

I would like one in Tungsten or Heritage.

I note that the Viper bottom has fallen out. Z06 appears to have eaten its lunch along with lack of concern from Dodge.

We shall see.

One thing is clear, even if (or because) the muscle car era ends once again, the GT certainly was a unique event. It is hard to fathom it ever being something less than a car of great pride.

(Never understood why there was not a GTCA (GT Club of America). I realize that there are limited vehicles but a pdf based newsletter etc would have seemed viable)

-doc

 

[B O N Y]

Mine is not an investment, it is my toy, not for sale, speculation. Most cars are very poor investments. Heaven help some of the folks wrapped up in the Barrett Jackson hype.

Just read the latest Brinker report out today. I agree we have had a market correction... no more, no less.

Car dealers tend to me like carnival pitch men, not to be taken to seriously.

 

[eshrink]

But Bony, it would have been "nice" to have a car that does hold stable in the market.

The fellow who arrived today to transport my car was talking about values/prices he has observed on the GT since he has been transporting them. He clearly loves the car, but he was surprised as the prices came down (he had a few interesting price-related stories).

Yes, this is a market correction (DYIA and NASDAQ) but even in a correct, monies are lost by most (made by a few).

I believe that in the not too distant future, one will be able to buy two new GTs from dealers who are tired of floor planning them at $800 each per month for what was once the gouging price for one.

Hmmm, maybe I need three. As my wife said, "You have three TIVOs...why not three GTs?"

- doc

 

[B O N Y]

But Bony, it would have been "nice" to have a car that does hold stable in the market.

The fellow who arrived today to transport my car was talking about values/prices he has observed on the GT since he has been transporting them. He clearly loves the car, but he was surprised as the prices came down (he had a few interesting price-related stories).

Yes, this is a market correction (DYIA and NASDAQ) but even in a correct, monies are lost by most (made by a few).

I believe that in the not too distant future, one will be able to buy two new GTs from dealers who are tired of floor planning them at $800 each per month for what was once the gouging price for one.

Hmmm, maybe I need three. As my wife said, "You have three TIVOs...why not three GTs?"

- doc

For years I have been writing market value and auction reviews for Car Collector, Victory Lane, Hemmings and in the beginning Sports Car Market.
We all know the GT would fall to MSRP after the rush to be an early adapter
was over. I had one of the first cars, paid $15k over window, so what, I wanted it, realized I could save some bucks but wanted the car now.

If the car goes up in value, fine, it is not for sale. Just like my other toys.
I could careless what the current price is for a '67 tripower Vette is, I got mine, and not in the market at today's prices for another one. Besides most of the ones I am seeing lately are as phony as a $3 bill :biggrin

Most folks will not spend 20 minutes a week planning their financial future.
They don't have a clue about the markets, and turn over the future to some salesman who calls himself a stock broker.

 

[eshrink]

How true, but perhaps it is not so bad to know the market value of any of your material holdings from equities to real estate to vehicles. As you point out, it is just being financially responsible (even if there is no intent to sell).

We have been in our home for 20 years and have watched it and the area grow incredibly, but there is no intent to sell during my lifetime. It is nice, however, to know the value and plan for the kids' status when they liquidate after we are gone.

- doc

 

[Doc]

Blue light special (sorta, since K-Mart bought Sears)

I believe that in the not too distant future, one will be able to buy two new GTs from dealers who are tired of floor planning them at $800 each per month for what was once the gouging price for one.

Hey Doc :wink ,

I agree that some dealers are getting a little worried about having to floor-plan the car. I've had a few call me back that wouldn't even talk to me a few months ago.

Yes, this is a market correction (DYIA and NASDAQ)

I'd add it is a normal correction. The support is busted, and I think we see a little more downward momentum until we find the next support level. It is nothing to worry about. Please keep in mind that the market is up 55% since the 2003 bottom.

Z06 appears to have eaten its lunch along with lack of concern from Dodge.

This car is very hot now. I drove a new Z06 (dealer/owner demonstrator) a couple of weeks ago and was impressed. I live near Tom Jumper Chev (Sandy Springs) and happened by last Saturday where they were having a Corvette car show. I really enjoyed seeing the old and new cars on parade.

'67 tripower Vette

Very nice car. I've always loved this era (although a "real" '63 Z06 327/360 is my all-time favorite).

Sports Car Market

bony, this is my favorite magazine. I really enjoy Keith Martin's writing and commentary. He (and all his staff-past and current) has taught me a lot about the collector market.

Most folks will not spend 20 minutes a week planning their financial future. They don't have a clue about the markets, and turn over the future to some salesman who calls himself a stock broker.

IMHO, most people spend less time than this on their portfolio, but they know every moment of 'American Idol'. :biggrin I do know of a few good commissioned brokers (not my thing, but I was in the fee based side of the business). Some brokers are very good and some very poor.

My experience was that the "smarter" individuals (e.g., lawyers and a few physicians) are the absolute worst in managing money. They work in their profession for 60+ hours a week and think that because they are intelligent that they can properly manage money in a couple of hours of work once a month. Ha! They just don't realize that those guys on the Street are smart, too. They have MBAs from Wharton, a research staff, and the same work ethic.

 

[eshrink]

I did not know that Tom Jumper had a car show; it is at that dealership where I saw standard Corvettes carrying a scrawled note of $6k over MSRP (three weeks ago) as a "market adjustment." That was pretty funny.

I would have liked to see the vintage Corvettes, have owned a few.

The fellow who picked up my car today was talking about values, he has watched them change as he has hauled GTs. He is a big fan of the car.

- doc

 

[Doc]

I did not know that Tom Jumper had a car show; it is at that dealership where I saw standard Corvettes carrying a scrawled note of $6k over MSRP (three weeks ago) as a "market adjustment." That was pretty funny.

:confused They offered me a Z06 at MSRP, and a Z51 with a "car show discount". They even made me drive one of the Z51s (nice car for $45K).

I had no idea they were having a show either. I just happened to be driving down Roswell Rd (to Jack's :biggrin ,Roswell@285). I guess they had at least 100 Corvettes (1953-2007) in the lot.

 

[eshrink]

We are in Sandy Springs/Dunwoody. I believe it was three Sundays ago, had been to RBM looking at the new S-class, and I passed and saw that Tom Jumper had a few Corvette Convertibles. I was looking at them when I noted that they had placed a tag next to the window sticker asking for $5-7k more for "market value." We just laughed.

There used to be an annual Corvette show in Decatur back in the 90s. It was very good, many nice restored cars.

I always thought that a Z51 convertible would be a nice grocery getter for me, but I am not enamoured of a Corvette, and the deepest I would go for one would be in the mid to upper 30s. They depreciate very rapidly, and I like to trade my grocery-getters pretty often.

The GT rather squelched my interest in other cars although I do like the 6 series BMW convertible as a family car.

- doc

 

[gtjim]

Doc,

Even though a current dip in the price point of available GT's, I suspect that as the end of the run occurs the prices will start to move in an upward direction.

While I hate to see the monetary value of something I purchase go down, my current thoughts are more along the line of "maybe now is the time to get a second GT".

I was so on such a high as I watched my GT being unloaded from an enclosed semi trailer in front of my house, now with so much talk about owning a second GT I starting to need that high again! Hmmm ... didn't you mention something like that in a different thread?

In any case, I'm one of those that plan on keeping my GT and passing on to my son many years from now. As for the second ....

 

[BlackICE]

...While I hate to see the monetary value of something I purchase go down, my current thoughts are more along the line of "maybe now is the time to get a second GT".
....

It sound like people who buy a stock and then when it goes down in price they double up! If it was a good buy at $50 it is a better buy at $40, or should I say if it is good at $180k it is a steal at $155k.

That said, a second one would be nice to have, but I have 3 problems with that:

1. I don't have enough parking spaces.
2. I had enough pain from my wife in buying the 1st one.
3. If I buy the 2nd one, I will have even less parking spaces after my divorce!


BlackICE

 

[eshrink]

Perhaps an American Revolution lift would sold the space problem.

 

[BlackICE]

I am planning to get a Benkpak lift. The problem is that to get a lift that is wide enough to use easily would make it take up more than one car spot in my garage. I have 4 spaces available 2 singles at each end and a double door in the middle. The left single is too close to the wall to make making the lift hard to use for servicing the car. The right single is a short space and wouldn't allow parking a longer car. Which leave to middle one. If I get a narrow lift it would barely fit if I try to use both spaces. The door is 16', but I have 2 posts, one on each side which make the car doors hard to open. Also I want to keep one bay open for a workshop area.

So I decided to get a wide lift a bendpak hd-12 and put that on one side of the double door and use the 3/4 space that is left for a work area. That will allow me to park 4 cars and have a workshop area. I already have 4 cars, thus no more toys for now.

BlackICE

 

[eshrink]

BlackICE

We gave up on the lift concept for largely the same reasons. The other thing that concerns me is more...er...psychological: If I have a car on a lift, I personally am less likely to drive it. The positives of a lift are too numerous to list, but as we investigated, measured and gathered quotes, it seemed less and less do-able. It is already a complex process of moving cars around in our situation, and I have a teen emerging who will need a car in fall. I would like my fun car(s) to be something I can drive upon impulse. I believe if I had to plan to move/lower vehicles in order to do it, I would be less likely to drive it. Also, that GT is quite wide; getting it on a Reliable transport yesterday was certaintly evidence of that.

- doc

 

[sharp33]

That said, a second one would be nice to have, but I have 3 problems with that:

1. I don't have enough parking spaces.
2. I had enough pain from my wife in buying the 1st one.
3. If I buy the 2nd one, I will have even less parking spaces after my divorce!


BlackICE

Consider a second GT an insurance policy. This way even if you get divorced you'll still have one! :banana

 

[eshrink]

I read a thread in another forum in which guys were talking about all that they had to go through to get a particular car...what they had to do in return, the flack that they caught and the berating they received.

- doc

 

[Doc]

Consider a second GT an insurance policy. This way even if you get divorced you'll still have one!

You'll need a good divorce lawyer! Most guys I know have basically lost everything. :eek

We are in Sandy Springs/Dunwoody.

Doc,
Do you work on "Pill Hill"?

I live near RBM/Tom Jumper in a subdivision on the river near Northridge/Roswell RD.

 

[eshrink]

Yes, I am in The Medical Quarters (5555 Peachtree-Dunwoody Rd) at the intersection of Johnson Ferry & Peachtree-Dunwoody Roads. Scottish Rite Hospital on one corner, Northside Hospital on another, and Saint Joseph's Hospital on the third corner. Area has certainly grown over the years.

- doc