FGT v. MP4

[azmurciev12]

both are my cars. i was driving the FGT, shifting at redline. FGT has accufab TB, pulley and tune from Torrie running 93map. MP4 is totally stock without the factory power update. i was totally surprised by the result.

[video=youtube;Voev2spgrLw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voev2spgrLw&list=UUEKDQogLkPShvYwlf9D4CxQ&index=2&feature=plcp[/video]


this is against the 458

[video=youtube;bRvnxGkNTvg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRvnxGkNTvg&list=UUEKDQogLkPShvYwlf9D4CxQ&index=1&feature=plcp[/video]

no car came close to the MP4 except my FGT: GT2RS, 458, 570SL and Ruf RT12 were several cars away at the end of the mile.

hope you guys enjoy the video.

 

[2112]

You can see the advantage the transmission gives the McLaren.

Wouldn't want the tranny in the FGT tho.

 

[Superfly]

You can see the advantage the transmission gives the McLaren.

Wouldn't want the tranny in the FGT tho.

^^^ This. QFT

 

[BlackICE]

Time for a Whipple, TT, or SC/TT.

 

[Fubar]

So this MP4 is rated at 600bhp?

 

[Empty Pockets]

From Autoweek:

"The car (Mac) has a curb weight of 2,866 pounds, much of it built with lightweight materials such as carbon fiber and aluminum."

"The twin-turbo, 3.8-liter V8 in the McLaren MP4-12C sports car cranks out 592 hp at 7,000 rpm, according to factory performance specs released on Sunday. The engine hits its torque peak of 443 lb-ft at 3,000 rpm and holds it up to 7,000 rpm."

So, the FGT is roughly 700 lbs heavier (+ or- the drivers' weight diff) and yet, with the "tune", about the same h.p. Therefore, basic math and logic would suggest that the Mac ought to best the GT in this scenario, no?

 

[BlackICE]

Top speed has more to do with aero drag to HP than HP/WT. From the video it seem that the MP4 didn't pull away until the later 1/2 so IMO the MP4 has a better HP/drag ratio that a FGT with a pulley and tune.

 

[dbk]

A McLaren is not 700 lbs lighter than a GT. That's the dry weight of the lightest variant possible. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see an MP4-12C in street condition weighing within 300 lbs of a GT. Lamborghini claims the LP570-4 Performante has a dry weight of 3,270. I went to the state certified scales, and with me (175) in the car it weighed dead even 4,000 lbs. Dry weight on a spec sheet doesn't mean much.

It wouldn't matter if they weighed the same, a stock MP4 is going to run all over a stock GT in every situation based on the transmission alone. The pulley and the tune on the GT make it much more competitive, but the ability to never lose momentum in a straight line is worth 100 hp on the street. DCT is the future. At the Rally, Ron Cline had his MP4 on the track, and he told me that after taking the modded GT out first, the minute he hit the corners in the McLaren he knew he was going to go much much faster in the MP4.

McLaren is a hell of a car for the price, especially since they've botched the marketing efforts and you can get them for a pretty good price.

 

[Xcentric]

Published performance numbers. 12C numbers from Car & Driver. FGT best numbers from various car mag tests of a stocker (+ Mark's actual top speed), so the 100 hp mods would presumably put the FGT in the best range of test numbers or perhaps slightly better.

12C...FGT

Zero to 60 mph: 2.9 sec...3.2 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 6.1 sec...7.4 sec
Zero to 150 mph: 13.9 sec...16.9 sec
¼-mile: 10.7 sec @ 134 mph...11.2 sec @ 131.2
Top speed: (drag limited, mfr’s claim) 205 mph... (drag limited, mark mcgowan actual) 211.89 mph
Roadholding, 120-ft-dia skidpad: 1.02 g...0.98 g
Curb weight: 3,187...~3,400-3,500 (Mac adds 80 lbs!)

Wish you had a camera in the 12C filming the GT.

 

[dbk]

That Ford GT had a pulley and tune back when they sent it to test with the Enzo and CGT. The people that run SVT now would not resort to such shenanigans. Ford GT is realistically a 124-126 mph car in most people's hands. 127-128 if you really know what you're doing. Not that it's hard to make a Ford GT go 131. Pulley/tune only my car went ~133.

 

[Xcentric]

127-128 if you really know what you're doing.

Or, if you're launching someone else's GT! :biggrin

 

[2112]

As fast as these new transmissions are, are they really as enjoyable as rowing thru the gears?

I mean, artificial insemination will produce offspring, but isn't the original old fashioned way just a wee bit more pleasurable?


:wink

 

[dbk]

Yes. If you like going fast, a dct is extremely entertaining. A winding road and a 458 is mind boggling entertainment.

 

[Fubar]

As DBK indicated, my experience with dual clutch transmission has been that is it THE evolution of the transmission for a sports car. It makes a great car, EPIC. It is faster, smoother, less maintenance and more predictable than older style transmission, be that F1 or true manual gear boxes. Expect for those of us who like to rest our hand on the shifter because it beckons images of Steve McQueen and dropping the clutch to burn the tires is fun, like nothing else (because you can literally smell the cash being burnt to bits)… there is no reason to even shop a car that doesn’t offer this, if you want to beat your best time at the track. There will no competitive car built without it going forward, IMHO.

 

[2112]

Less maintenance than a manual transmission?

 

[Greg-TT]

Two of my favorite cars hands down.
They are the best of both worlds the last of the analog cars in the GT and the best digital cars in the 12C.

 

[Sinovac]

I would want the advantage of a DCT if I raced competitively like many here or raced to earn a paycheck. On a fun street car, no thanks. The advantage of a DCT is that it makes the car go faster. I completely agree, but going faster doesn't mean the driving experience is more fun, particularly on the street. Auto transmissions have dominated drag racing for years, but no one seriously argues they are more entertaining on the street. The service intervals on the new DCTs are very impressive, but when they do go out, be prepared to grab your ankles. I also doubt that a DCT on a high performance car that is driven as intended will have a lower overall service cost than a manual.

A car with a manual is not competitive on a track against a similarly equipped DCT car, but I'll continue to cling to my manuals like I do my guns and religion

 

[Cobrar]

I would want the advantage of a DCT if I raced competitively like many here or raced to earn a paycheck. On a fun street car, no thanks. The advantage of a DCT is that it makes the car go faster. I completely agree, but going faster doesn't mean the driving experience is more fun, particularly on the street.

+1. DCT is happy when matched with high revs. A real PITA around town.

 

[bonehead]

I would want the advantage of a DCT if I raced competitively like many here or raced to earn a paycheck. On a fun street car, no thanks. The advantage of a DCT is that it makes the car go faster. I completely agree, but going faster doesn't mean the driving experience is more fun, particularly on the street. Auto transmissions have dominated drag racing for years, but no one seriously argues they are more entertaining on the street. The service intervals on the new DCTs are very impressive, but when they do go out, be prepared to grab your ankles. I also doubt that a DCT on a high performance car that is driven as intended will have a lower overall service cost than a manual.

A car with a manual is not competitive on a track against a similarly equipped DCT car, but I'll continue to cling to my manuals like I do my guns and religion

Hallelujah! Gospel, my friend!

 

[RALPHIE]

I would want the advantage of a DCT if I raced competitively like many here or raced to earn a paycheck. On a fun street car, no thanks. The advantage of a DCT is that it makes the car go faster. I completely agree, but going faster doesn't mean the driving experience is more fun, particularly on the street. Auto transmissions have dominated drag racing for years, but no one seriously argues they are more entertaining on the street. The service intervals on the new DCTs are very impressive, but when they do go out, be prepared to grab your ankles. I also doubt that a DCT on a high performance car that is driven as intended will have a lower overall service cost than a manual.

A car with a manual is not competitive on a track against a similarly equipped DCT car, but I'll continue to cling to my manuals like I do my guns and religion

:bow :agree: :bow